'Australian Beauty'

Anyone know much about this rose: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]? It's seed parent is the plant sold as 'Adam' here (which I've just ordered along with Marie Van Houte). Interested to know which side of the family tree it takes after; the tea side or the HP side???

Interesting to know how Marie VH grows down your way.

Ours was 5 metres diamaeter and 3 metres high until it collapsed after a storm last year. We cut it back a bit and it is growing back strongly. Not as many flowers (gets covered by them) but they will return.

Adam is also a strong grower with lots of flowers in spring but vitually has flowers on at all times.

It's been an intersting year as fra as Teas go down here. A mixed bag! I don't have a lot of Teas because they are something I have only recently taken an interest in. The ones I have had in for between 1 and 2 years now are; 'Comtesse de Labarthe' (CdL), 'Lorraine Lee', 'Safrano', 'Souvenir de MME Leonie Viennot' (SdMLV), 'Francis Dubreuil' (NOT) (FDN), 'Monsier Tillier', and the new Australian bred one called 'St Francis Xavier'. Also have Rosa gigantea growing here as well which I group with the Teas given their close connection. Of these the stand out performers were CdL, Mosier Tillier' and 'Lorraine Lee'. They've grown strongly all year and are still putting out new growth and flowers. 'Safrano' started strongly then died in the bum. It lost ALL its leaves was a BIG disapointment. 'St Francis Xavier' and 'FD' turned up virused and have sulked all year. 'SdMLV' is growing well but not as strongly as the the others. Gigantea also is growing well but again not as well as the first three. All of these except 'CdL' are n their first year so it's early days yet. 'CdL' is in her second year and started very slowly, gathering pace as she aged. So... I'll be watching these Teas here over the next few years to see how they do. I'm hoping 'SdMLV' really takes off next year and starts climbing the dead gum I've put her on.

Simon

I figure that it may be a bit cool down there for them. Most grow really well up here tough at resent they ar infested with bugs and grubs. Its's been so wet up here I am surprised thay are still alive at all.

Simon

Where did you get 'St Francis Xavier'

I'll PM you

Hi Simon, look after those Australian beauty cuttings for I would really like to have this rose.

I don't have it yet.... I have 'Nancy Hayward' cuttings. I wanted to find out more information about it before trying to track it down.

Bruce, I have emailed the Victoria State Rose Garden at Werribee Park to see if they still have it as the photos on HMF were taken there and asked if it is possible to purchase propagating material from them. Will keep you posted.

It's messy. According to the Tealadies, the rose sold in Aus as Adam (and the one labelled "The President" at Pt Arthur) are probably Mme Berard. The rose sold in Aus as Mme Berard is E Veyrat Hermanos.

Yes... "Adam"'s tale is a messy one, however, I wonder whether we ever had the real 'Adam' here? I know a few years back when the Heritage Rose Soc. came to Tas they thought they had found the real 'Adam' growing down near Launceston (from memory... don't quote me on the location... was a while back they told me). It turned out to be something else (again... I don't remember what). What sparked my interest in "Adam" (I'm using the Tea book's manner of nomenclature with double quotes for ones that aren't the real one in commerce and single quotes for those that are) is looking at the pedigree of 'Australian Beauty'... for two reasons; the first is that it is a Tea and is fertile and the second is it seems to make good looking progeny... I wanted to know if anyone grew it ('Australian Beauty') to describe how it grew as I'm interested to know whether it takes after its Tea parent or its Hybrid Perpetual parent to give me more of an idea of what to put it with. I'm assuming "Adam" is diploid, as most Teas seem to be, in which case 'Australia Beauty' is probably a triploid because my understanding is that most HP are tetraploids... so... I'm really trying to get a feel for how it will breed and what to put with it to further our goal of breeding roses for Australian conditions.

Bruce... good news... Werribee Park has got back to me and has told me we can have cuttings. All we need to do is send them a pre-paid self-addressed package. I'll take care of that for you and send yours with mine. I'm having a few medical issues at the moment so am not sure when I will get to it but it will be before June when they start their pruning.

Thanks Simon, best of luck with your health issues.

Simon, MVH is a Tea - and sets hips!
Hope you're feeling better.

Thanks Dave, That's why I bought it... that and "Adam"... am starting to feel like a pin cushion... off for more blood tests this morning

Got word back from a gentleman called Wal Johnston, president of the Friends of Victoria State Rose Garden, who advised me that whilst we were welcome to obtain cuttings of AB, the plant itself is very prone to mildew... do you still want me to pursue this for you Bruce? My feeling is that the mildew susceptibility is probably quite climate influenced and that it probably got this from "Adam" as a lot fo the Teas (down here at least) seem prone to mildew attack. The fact that it is also a climber suggests to me that it may indeed take after its Tea side more than its HP side.

I don't think I made myself clear enough - there were roses known as Adam and President in Australia when Aus Beauty was bred (see Anlaby list in the Tea book). So I don't think the faults of Aus Beauty can be blamed on the rose incorrectly identified as Adam in the 1970s, and introduced into Aus in 1980. I'm hoping to get Aus Beauty for the Early HT collection at Renmark - it will be interesting to see how it does there.
Good luck with the health things.

MVH and "Adam" both set hips readily.

I am going to try to get some seeds going again from one of these.

Something ate the 6 or so that I had. Thye were about 3 cm tall and I checked them one arvo and the next morning they were all gone apart from a couple of stems.

The next question I wanted to ask was has the real 'Adam' ever been here? I wonder which one was the seed parent of 'Australian Beauty'? I guess I should have made myself more clear as well in that I was more blaming the susceptibility to mildew on the Tea blood (in general) and not "Adam" specifically given a lot of the Teas I have seem also to be prone to mildew (the only one that isn't so far is 'Monsier Tillier'... another can of worms rose LOL... 'Souv. de MME Leonie Viennot' and even gigantea itself get a little mildew here but are next in line in terms of resitance to mildew. 'Comtesse de Labarth', 'Sir Francis Xavier', 'Francis Dubreuil' NOT, 'Lorraine Lee', 'Rosa Indicia Major', 'Lamarque', and 'Safrano' all seem quite susceptible... I've included Teas, Noisettes together. Crepuscule and 'Lady Huntingfield' seem quite immune to both mildew and black spot here. "Adam" and 'Marie Van Houtte' have just arrived and don't have leaves yet so ask me about them again this time next year). In this respect I don't think it matters much whether its seed parent was 'Adam', "Adam", 'MME Berard', or 'The President'... the outcome may have been similar. What I am more interested in is whether AB takes after the Tea side or the HP side because it gives me an idea as to how the Tea traits seem to be passed on from "Adam" in this cross. Judging by AB's reputation of being prone to mildew and that it is a climber like "Adam" is I would say the Tea traits feature prominently in this case... this is a good thing as it is these feature I think we should be trying to retain in any breeding program involving Teas. If Wal Johnston said it was prone the black spot I would have assumed it was probably from the HP side of the family.

Hi Simon, I still want to try it up here in Sydney. I get Powdery Mildew on roses I have on a south wall but all other positions are OK.

Would still like to have it and form my own conclusions.

Look at Souvenir de Claudius Pernet where everyone suggested it was a Blackspot Magnet. It is flowering so well at present and it's Autumn blooms are 3 shades deeper yellow. A very nice yellow HT rose that doesn't deserve the less than favourable reputation.

Would you please ask the guy to mail direct to me if you don't want to bother with it. Will Email my address direct to you if you don't have it.

Please let me also have details regarding costs so I can send direct or to you.

Bruce

Update, Australian Beauty wood was very old but have one ownroot (Early Days) shooting and another calloused and just planted.

There is one minute bud on Multiflora at a stand still making 3 posabilities in all.

All the ownroot roses I have propagated here were duds except for New Dawn, Albertine and Cecile Brunner. Most of the Tea's did not grow well on their ownroots. I expect we are asking too much from all the varieties of roses to do well in the large variety of soils in Australia. The same can be said of Multiflora and other different roses used as rootstock.
Have heard Multiflora doesn't like acid soil however I have had roses on Multiflora surrounded by Kikuyu that is growing yellow because the PH is around 3. So the search for the perfect propagation method goes on but somehow I think it is down the back with the Le'prechauns.

Multiflora loves acid soils... that's what does well down here on pH 5.5. It's Dr Phooey hates acidic soil.

I had one 'Australian Beauty' cutting fail, one look to have taken and is sprouting, and one that started to fail which was recut and started again.

I had a look in the igloo last week (near Renmark), and I think all our Aus Beauty cuttings are failing. One of the very few from this winter's batch.

Bruce, how did your Australian Beauty cuttings go? I have one going that is flowering now. It's not big enough to take cuttings from yet but will be next year.

Simon all the cuttings failed, I never have great success with old cuttings covered in scale. Upon looking over the cuttings when they arrived I put a bud about 1/4 the size of a normal bud on Multiflora as described in my previous post. The shoot and cane that grew from this is very thin though has managed to produce 2 or 3 blooms. Will wait and see what developes.
I have a good rose friend who just recently told me she has a new plant in an 8" pot . Will keep in touch with her and see if her plant makes some normal size buds. Failing that will get back to you for a couple of normal size buds.

I am sure the caretaker who selected the wood gave us the best he could as he apologised mentioning there had been very little growth that year.

Regards the understocks, have heard a multitude of different reports so I tend to propagate the easiest to grow. I can bud multiflora 365 days of the year in Sydney so that is an attraction.

Just had a call from a guy in SA who bought roses from me last season and has been delighted with the growth. He recons they are better than any of the roses he bought elsewhere. He proceeded to go through a lot of nurseries he bought from. Would appear Chip budding on Multiflora produces a good result in SA, WA, Vic, NSW and Qld. so why change.
How's your Don Juan going? That's a good experiment as the tape was left on for 3 to 4 years with the soil hilled up over the tape and bud.

Everyone likes young Multiflora understocks, particularly the rabbits.

Well I would be interested in seeing how roses perform on the multiflora here.
Fortuniana is dismal in my books though recommended for W.A .
Multiflora failed miserably in the sandy soils of my mum's garden in Gosnells but I have long forsaken that dismal coastal sandplain .
Ol' Dr Huey is delivering despite our bore water testing in the 5's range so I would be very interested to see the performance of Multiflora if that is supposed to cope with acidity better.

cheers. Rosalie