OFF topic Catalogue

I have been looking at different nurseries around the world and came across this one in England, some of the roses might interest some, they have me, have a look, if you look at his story, he has had a good grounding with roses.
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The Lazy Rosarian wrote:...
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I bought 5 roses from him:

Rosa Roxburghii
Rosa wichuriana
Bengal Beauty
Mutabilis
Ispahan

He is reliable.

Just seen this catalogue. Oh, I wish! Love Papi Delbard. Has anyone grown it? Is it available in Australia?

We have a couple of Papi Delbards. One is grown from a cutting of the other. We have them on stands but they have not done all that fantastic and should be grown as climbers I think. Nice large flowers.

From what I've seen in the pictures on the internet from a russian website which I include below. In the picture Papi Delbard is growing next to very mature tree very happily. I want to utilise the space around the Oaks we have. Very few roses perform well when they planted so close to the tree. SO I will add the Papi Delbard to the list and see what happens:

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Alya, I seem to recall that some oak trees are allelopathic, and contain a toxin called coumarin, which causes trouble for certain other plants when grown near oaks. I don't know which particular oak trees contain the toxin or what type of plants the toxin inhibits, so it would be worth a bit of research before planting anything valuable under them!

The Lazy Rosarian wrote:

SueH wrote:Just seen this catalogue.  Oh, I wish!  Love Papi Delbard.  Has anyone grown it?  Is it available in Australia?

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Thank you David! Sorry for the delay!

thanks for that info muscovyduckling.

This explain why my visteria never flowered eventually after 13 years I pulled it out.

We had a Hawtorn tree we cut down last year. Even though we dug out the soil  and replaced it with fresh ones nothing grew around the trunk and the roots because the chemical substance roots and the trunk was sprouting from the cut. The cut was continuously bleeding poison. Eventually we concreted the top of the trunk to stop the bleeding.

My Rhubarbs are very slow since I moved them near the Oak trees...planted them more than 1m away from the main trunk but about 10cm above the roots of the Oak. If they do not go wild next year I will move them somewhere else.

I have Dreaming Spires, Handel, Seagull, Red Max Graf, Danse De Fu, Madame Alfred Carriera, Iceberg Climber, Surrey, Rosa Virginiana all planted next to the Oak trees. All happily flowering well so far touch wood...The colour of  Papi Delbard will add more colour I hope.

Our winter flowering evergreen clematis is right against the Oak tree. This clematis wrapped itself around the trunk. It flowers in May -June and definitely not in winter or early spring as it should do. On the other Oak I have another clematis Montana.

There is also a Yew seedling sprouting rigt from under the Oak tree.

I have got to make use of the space we have got...So I beg the Oak trees to be gentle to my plants and in return I promise to feed them with bone meal....I speak to my trees you know! I give them hug and cuddles too.. soo they behave themselves too I suppose...

Well it's good that you've got a lot of things growing there Alya. I suppose it will mean a bit of trial and error, but as you say you have to make the most of your space, so definitely worth it (even if your clematis does flower a bit late, hahaha).

We have the same issue here with some of our big gum trees, the eucalyptus oil in their leaves makes it hard to grow a lot of things near them, and also they're very thirsty and will out-compete a lot of things planted within their root zone. So I feel your pain!

Ahhh Eucalyptus trees... I grew some from the seeds especially for the lovely bark they have. Then later they rocked with the wind soo much they become very unstable and leaned to the ground.. I had to dig them out...

Except Clematis Nelly Moser nothing gew next to the Gum trees. I planted Nelly Moser first and it was very small and few hours later I tucked the gum tree as a very small seedling about 20cm away from Nelly..both grew together very well and the trunk got fatter and fatter taking Nelly underneath.. Somehow Nelly loved it there and produced magnificient flowers.. Since I dug out the Gum tree in 2013 Nelly stopped flowering...All of the plants and roses who were there before the gum tree did perfectly OK.

Somehow the Oaks are much more accomodationg than the gum trees Hawthorns in our garden. Touch wood so far 90% of whatever I planted did OK next to the Oaks.

Do you have tree preservation order stuck on the gum trees?

Our Oaks are protected by the law with Tree Preservation Order. In order to do some work on them like pruning we have to ask the local council's permisssion..apply for a planning permission in the councul's planning department and pay for the application.
Otherwise there is a hefty fine and  a black mark against the people who do not obey. it is blessing that Our Oaks have a very handsome look to them...

Yeah, we have some rules about native plants in our area too. Where I live, we're allowed to do anything we like to trees that are within 10 metres of our house, and shrubs within 40 metres of the house. If they're further away than that, we need the council permit like you do.

It used to be for any native vegetation you'd need a permit but after the big bushfires in Victoria in 2009 they changed the rules a bit.

I have 6 gum trees are within 10 metres of my house and I would actually like to have them removed. Although I don't need a permit, the quotes I've had are in the range of about $12,000 so it's not an option at the moment anyway!

Ouchh!!! How old your gum trees are?

My 2 gum trees were about 12 years old when they were gone....thin slender type gum trees never able to put large tunks out...the grith being never more that 30cm in diameter. Then my other half and I spent one day on each to dig the stumps out.  So I learned a bit what the the root structure of those gum trees were like.

Oh gosh, doesn't sound like a fun job, but at least you learned something!

Our trees are remnant vegetation from when this area was forest. I have no idea how old they are, but I'd be guessing at least 80 years old. They are very tall and hang over the house, and the trunks are between 1 and 1.5 metres diameter, so they will be really tricky to remove. I guess that's why it will cost so much!

OOhhh yes it is almost impossible.. you need serious industrial diggers to help....

yesterday i watched a program on the TV about what is going on below the surface of the ground you stand on around an Oak tree in the UK.  They measured the grith of an 450 years old Oak tree as 6.5 meters in diameters and the height as 6 meters. Then they mapped the roots of the tree with radars sending waves to the underground using one of the 4 or five machines in the world who can do this job.  They mapped the spread of the roots. The outcome was the spread of the roots of the tree was 6.7 meters in diameter  having 1 meter deep tap root from the trunk downwards. The rest of the roots were all around the tree  with a very good strong structure to help the tree survive for anotuher 450 years the least.

So if you take this as a guidance roughly you would have something similar to this exercise. Almost impossible to get rid of in one go.... the trees spread their roots about 10% more that the height of the tree itself.  So not surprised for the amount they asked to remove the trees

A lottery winn would do nicely... aaahhaa come on good old lady luck...ping our back with your arrow!!!

find someone who wants good oak wood and get them to remove it for the cost of the wood....

PS....and back fill....

Sounds very good...I would say well done to myself...but ..need to get the mother nature to get the Oak uprooted or something.. then the council would have imposed the condition on me that I will plant new Oak where the old one was.. even though this would be a good deal ..would take years and tears to become another big Oak ..

Ahh Neptune, good idea - sadly no-one wants stringybark timber

Zoe, is there any Tafe colleges near you that teach arbor skills, they could learn on your trees.

Oh I don't know, good idea though! I hope they don't squash my house.. I will ring around on Monday.

muscovyduckling wrote:Oh I don't know, good idea though! I hope they don't squash my house.. I will ring around on Monday.

Your house must be old enough to know that the foundations are sound and strong and there is no damage to the foundations so far I would not worry about the roots. Otherwise you would have got rid of the trees by now. Just enjoy the trees while they are still with you.

The height would give headache and worry if anything like where we are. The first question the insurance company asks us when getting the household insurace "Is there any tall tree higher than the roof of the house and less than 6 meters away from the house?" ... Any excuse to increase the premium!

Please tell me if what I know is correct or wrong:

The tiny hairy small roots know to turn around and go away when they come near things like the foundations...big chunky roots follow the tiny ones. So no root will develop into a big chunky ones to start putting pressure to the foundations .

I would worry about the roots of plants like the wild ivy or Agapanthus or a japanese knotweed...and not tree roots . The roots will let you know if the foundations are weak and has (hairy) cracks somehow and has some problems.

I can only imagine that you guys and girls are regulary cutting down quite a lot of the branches to keep the the Eucalyptus oil under control in case of a bushfire. God forbid! - we need someone's help like him/her to help us... natural disaster no matter what -

muscovyduckling wrote:Yeah, we have some rules about native plants in our area too. Where I live, we're allowed to do anything we like to trees that are within 10 metres of our house, and shrubs within 40 metres of the house. If they're further away than that, we need the council permit like you do.

It used to be for any native vegetation you'd need a permit but after the big bushfires in Victoria in 2009 they changed the rules a bit.

I have 6 gum trees are within 10 metres of my house and I would actually like to have them removed. Although I don't need a permit, the quotes I've had are in the range of about $12,000 so it's not an option at the moment anyway!

$12K? They charge a lot more then they do up here. We had a about 8 20 year old blue gums removed and chipped up for $1800 plus another $400 to have the stumps ground up.

We had a huge (I'm talking a diameter of about 1200-1500mm at 0.5metres off the ground) Tallowwood up the back that suddenly died. It had a lot of branches hanging out over the neighbours Lychee trees so we though we better get it taken out. $1400 to have it cut down and the smaller stuff chipped. The log was taken away and milled (there is a funny story about this in another topic). The stump is still there but it is not in the way so it will be staying there.

Hahahaha. I remember that story! I had the best mental images from that.

I'm not worried about the roots Gary, our house is on stumps anyway. I'd like the ones near the house removed as the big branches overhang the house, two of the biggest trees are dead, and the rest shade a lot of the back garden to the south. Also, one day we'd like to install solar panels on the roof but the trees shade the roof too much as it is.

I will get some more quotes soon to see if I can lower that figure a bit. But they're very big stringybark trees, and I think $2000/tree to have then chopped and chipped might be about the going rate around here

Oh and no, we don't prune the eucalypts or anything for bushfire management, the first branches are about 15 metres up, so we can't do that without an arborist team.